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Don
oil pump problems


I have a 354 truck engine and a hot heads 340 oil pump with adaptor for 392.The truck engine has a taller rear main cap than the car engine,and I believe it is shorter than the 392 rear main cap.My problem is that the oil pump bottoms out on the block and the intermediate shaft before the adaptor plate (3/32" gap between pump mount and plate).My thought was to install a 1/16" gasket on both sides of adaptor plate which should give me the proper spacing.If you see any problems with this, or have a better idea let me know.Maybe somebody else has ran into this or maybe I'm just missing something?
-- (Also I'm assuming the dist. gear sits flat on the bushing.)
Thanks Don.
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on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [19:53 UTC] reads: 17122

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HotHead
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [14:04 UTC] score: 0.00
> Don: The problem is the inconsistancy of the depth of the hole in the cap. Over 95% of the caps are the same. We've found 3 differant (short) depths over the years. The solution as stated here is to remove material from the collar until the pump sits flat on the cap or drill the hole deeper. Don't modify any shafts. This issue is adderessed in the instructions following Duanes conflict but you may have an earlier version. Give us a call if there's any misunderstanding.
Thanks,
Bob Walker

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stromberg97
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [19:14 UTC] score: 0.00
> > Don: The problem is the inconsistancy of the depth of the hole in the cap. Over 95% of the caps are the same. We've found 3 differant (short) depths over the years. The solution as stated here is to remove material from the collar until the pump sits flat on the cap or drill the hole deeper. Don't modify any shafts. This issue is adderessed in the instructions following Duanes conflict but you may have an earlier version. Give us a call if there's any misunderstanding.
> Thanks,
> Bob Walker

Thanks Bob for all your help and patience with all my ?????????s
Hemis are the best..
Duane..
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/Running241Hemi001.jpg
http://s90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/?action=view&current=241DodgeHemi_1.flv

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [04:04 UTC] score: 0.00
> I had to grind down a small section of the adaptor plate, main bolt washer and a bit of the main cap. This got me real close,(about 1/32" away). sanded down sleeve a small bit and now pump fits very well. Installed new intermediate shaft and found it to be 1/8" long on pump end and 3/16" long on dist. end. Will recheck measurements tommorrow and take shaft to machine shop to have shortened.Will also have pump shaft fixed as well,(thanks for the info, pictures were very helpful). Hopefully that will put an end to this problem.I appriciate all of your time and help, I'm really enjoying this rebuild.

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [04:22 UTC] score: 0.00
This is great news, now you can tackle the next adventure. Have fun post some pics it takes a while to figure that out my son helped me, check my post on my build here on the hemi site. Gerry

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gerrymoe
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [03:41 UTC] score: 0.00
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/OilPumpShaft340001.jpg


Don

If this works it shows a picture of Duanes oil pump that has the adaptor sleeve still on it. You see the small diameter side that is the end we ground off by 3/32. Hope this helps Gerry

Thanx Duane you are ahead of me I posted this off your test, we are getting good at this picture thing. Click on using the forum and click on my photo post my first. Gerry

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [17:07 UTC] score: 0.00
> Last night I cleaned up the side of the main cap (just below the bolt) were the pump was hitting.Now it is bottoming out on the sleeve just where you said.I didn't want to sand down the sleeve until I got my new shaft from Hot Heads. The wife called about an hour ago and said it showed up today.If I ever get done working (going to be a long day) I will check the fit tonight. Will let you know how things work out. And unfortunetly I'm on the other side of the country, just north of Pittsburgh PA.

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stromberg97
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [22:47 UTC] score: 0.00
> > Last night I cleaned up the side of the main cap (just below the bolt) were the pump was hitting.Now it is bottoming out on the sleeve just where you said.I didn't want to sand down the sleeve until I got my new shaft from Hot Heads. The wife called about an hour ago and said it showed up today.If I ever get done working (going to be a long day) I will check the fit tonight. Will let you know how things work out. And unfortunetly I'm on the other side of the country, just north of Pittsburgh PA.

Don..If your getting a new oil pump shaft or the one you have, I would take it to a machinist and have the taper radiused. It is a weak spot in the shaft..I fractured mine, got a new one and had it radiused.. Again, once you get your pump and the intermediate shaft inplace be sure to check the distributor is flat on the block..
Duane.

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stromberg97
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Re: Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Fri 05 of Sep, 2008 [03:09 UTC] score: 0.00
> > > Last night I cleaned up the side of the main cap (just below the bolt) were the pump was hitting.Now it is bottoming out on the sleeve just where you said.I didn't want to sand down the sleeve until I got my new shaft from Hot Heads. The wife called about an hour ago and said it showed up today.If I ever get done working (going to be a long day) I will check the fit tonight. Will let you know how things work out. And unfortunetly I'm on the other side of the country, just north of Pittsburgh PA.
>
> Don..If your getting a new oil pump shaft or the one you have, I would take it to a machinist and have the taper radiused. It is a weak spot in the shaft..I fractured mine, got a new one and had it radiused.. Again, once you get your pump and the intermediate shaft inplace be sure to check the distributor is flat on the block..
> Duane.
Here are some pictures..
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/OilPumpShaft340001.jpg
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/Sleeve002.jpg
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k276/STROMBERG97_2006/NewOilPumpShaft003.jpg

Will this help..
Duane

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [20:11 UTC] score: 0.00
> And unfortunetly I'm on the other side of the country, just north of Pittsburgh PA.

Thats to bad if you were on the ca side I would have came and helped ya out on this. I know the frustration of trying to do something over the internet. The intermediate shaft will have no effect on the fitting of the oil pump, it lines up the cam gear and provides the correct lenght for distributer and oil pump shaft connection. Grind the small side of the sleeve, the sleeve keeps the shaft centers in line the lenght can be altered as long as you don't take to much that lets it fall out of the main cap. Keep us informed I know you will get this. Gerry

author message
stromberg97
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [06:54 UTC] score: 0.00
> I have a 354 truck engine and a hot heads 340 oil pump with adaptor for 392.The truck engine has a taller rear main cap than the car engine,and I believe it is shorter than the 392 rear main cap.My problem is that the oil pump bottoms out on the block and the intermediate shaft before the adaptor plate (3/32" gap between pump mount and plate).My thought was to install a 1/16" gasket on both sides of adaptor plate which should give me the proper spacing.If you see any problems with this, or have a better idea let me know.Maybe somebody else has ran into this or maybe I'm just missing something?
> -- (Also I'm assuming the dist. gear sits flat on the bushing.)
> Thanks Don.

Hello Don..Gerry is giving you the right info..The sleeve that slides over the oil pump shaft needs to be sanded down..I believe he said the pump end..Sand down the end that is upward, the small end of the sleeve..Gerry and I had to do this with mine, it took about 6hrs to get it right. You will have to install the sleeve everytime you sand to check for fit. You will most likely need a different intermediate shaft lenght..I did with mine. The distributor wouldn't sit flush on the block..
Where do you live..
Duane.

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [00:30 UTC] score: 0.00
> I know the area you are talking about,and I wondered if the sleeve should have been further down. I will try that and let you know how it turns out. Thanks for your help,it sounds like this might be the sollution I was looking for (fingers crossed).

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [02:32 UTC] score: 0.00
>I notice our times of communication , I believe you are on Pacific time. Where are you located? If you are near Madera Ca or Sacramento Ca there is someone who has encountered this problem. Duane Scarbec from Sac and myselfin Madera.

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Thu 04 of Sep, 2008 [02:24 UTC] score: 0.00
> > I know the area you are talking about,and I wondered if the sleeve should have been further down. I will try that and let you know how it turns out. Thanks for your help,it sounds like this might be the sollution I was looking for (fingers crossed).

I have been thinking about this, I did one on a persons hemi, his name is Duane he is on this site also. We had to grind some off the sleeve, on the side that touches the oil pump, we took off about 3/32 using a belt sander. I am pretty confidant you are going to have to do the same thing. Gerry

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [21:50 UTC] score: 0.00
> If I could figure out how I would post a picture. I really appriciate the help.

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [21:47 UTC] score: 0.00
> The pump shaft and intermediate shaft are lined up correctly, and I am using the stock intermediate shaft at this time. (waiting on new shaft to arrive from hot heads). But even with out sleeve and shaft the cast part of the pump below the sleeve hits the main cap before the pump sits flat on the adaptor plate. I think the problem is that the adaptor is made for the 392 which has an even taller main cap?

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [22:10 UTC] score: 0.00
> But even with out sleeve and shaft the cast part of the pump below the sleeve hits the main cap before the pump sits flat on the adaptor plate.

Using a file file the cast area of the pump, you will see it is slightly rounded square it up, take little increments at a time, this is the area I did on mine. Be patient and take little increments at a time you will get it, several people on this site have had this problem. I am familiar with the area you are talking about, when you clean that area you will notice the sleeve will fit lower on pump. Gerry

might be able to take a little off adaptor in the area interference is, spray some blue lay-out ink and let it dry than mock up and it will show you where work needs to be done. Also loosen up the bolts that bolt the adaptor to the main and move it in the opposite direwction from oil pump shaft and tighten it won't be much maybe not even noticeble but every bit helps

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Don
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [20:22 UTC] score: 0.00
There is a sleeve,but even before the sleeve hits the block the pump shaft bottoms out on the intemediate shaft.So if I shortened the sleeve I would have to shorten either the pump shaft or the intermediate shaft.If I did all that I think the pump body just below the sleeve would hit the block (its real close right now).

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [20:30 UTC] score: 0.00
> There is a sleeve,but even before the sleeve hits the block the pump shaft bottoms out on the intemediate shaft.So if I shortened the sleeve I would have to shorten either the pump shaft or the intermediate shaft.If I did all that I think the pump body just below the sleeve would hit the block (its real close right now).


In the three situations with this adaptor set-up I have encountered it has always been the sleeve. The intermediate shaft and oil pump shaft are not lined up, remove the intermediate shaft install oil pump and re-install intermediate shaft, you may have to use long screw driver and rotate oil pump shaft slightly to align. It also could be that you have the wrong intermediat shaft I know there are a couple different lengths. I am reading between the lines and am guessing you are trying this with the intermediate shaft and distributor installed.

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gerrymoe
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Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [20:14 UTC] score: 0.00
Is there a round sleeve that slides over the shaft of oil pump if so grind off (on a belt sander preferably) 3/32 off of this sleeve. Oil pump shaft, intermediate shaft and distributer shaft length is effected if you use the gasket theory.biggrin

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gerrymoe
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Re: Re: oil pump problems
on: Wed 03 of Sep, 2008 [20:21 UTC] score: 0.00
> Is there a round sleeve that slides over the shaft of oil pump if so grind off (on a belt sander preferably) 3/32 off of this sleeve. Oil pump shaft, intermediate shaft and distributer shaft length is effected if you use the gasket theory.biggrin



A way to check this is to leave the sleeve off and mock it up and see if the problem goes away.


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